Bart Gazendam, [13 Jun 2022 at 06:37:35]: Morning everyone - has anyone used BMM in tigers? Henry Labuschagne, [13 Jun 2022 at 07:30:09]: I have used it in Bengal and Siberian tigers long ago. I prefer a medetomidine + ketamine combination. Yesterday I did a few young tigers with medetomidine 1mg per 40kg, plus 50mg ketamine per 1mg medetomidine used and it worked fine. I normally use 100mg ketamine per 1mg medetomidine Paul Reynolds: Medetomidine / ketamine for big tigers. Worked fine. 10mg medetomidine /250 mg ketamine Wait 20mins 160-180kgs Annie Mears, [14 Jun 2022 at 09:44:04]: I use medetomidine and ketamine on tigers but I have routinely improved the anaesthesia by adding midazolam especially for travel. So I often use MMK but I have to inject the midazolam once down as can’t fit into a dart. The only thing that stops me from using BMM would be dart volume HO Reuter, [14 Jun 2022 at 10:02:41]: Ulf’s predator mix (Zoletil, medetomidine, butorphanol) works very well (on lion, leopard cheetah and hyena), never tried on tigers, but good reports on this WhatsApp group on tigers too, previously. 1ml / 200 kg resolves all dart volume issues. Pasted from Ulf’s WhatsApp posting: “I have recently been using a mix of Zoletil, medetomidine and butorphanol with great success especially on rapid reversal. Take 1 zoletil powder, add 100 mg butorphanol (I use 50 mg/ml) and 20 mg medetomidine (20 mg/ ml) to this add 2 ml zoletil solvent to get total of 5 ml. I Use 1 ml/200 kg thus routinely dart adult male lion with 1 ml dart. At 0.1 ml/20 kg works well on other predators and you can essentially immobilise 5 male lions using 1 bottle of zoletil. Mixture is stable over months at room temperature. Reversal with naltrexone and atipamezole/yohimbine is very smooth”. Really a very nice anaesthesia! Henry Labuschagne, [14 Jun 2022 at 10:08:37]: I stay away from Zoletil / Zoletil cocktails in tigers. HO Reuter, [14 Jun 2022 at 10:09:33]: Why no Zoletil on them? Henry Labuschagne, [14 Jun 2022 at 10:13:20]: I had a few tigers that seizured after Zoletil, especially white tigers. Then just avoided it and I am happy with medetomidine and ketamine David Pretorius, [14 Jun 2022 at 10:14:50]: Henry, what is your preferred medetomidine and ketamine dose in tigers? Henry Labuschagne, [14 Jun 2022 at 10:42:42]: 1mg medetomidine per 40 kg plus 100mg ketamine per 1mg medetomidine used. Johan Wessels: Need a short acting safe cocktail for animal and man to relocate from one enclosure to another. Or is Zoletil the best option? Henry Labuschagne: I have done many with medetomidine 1mg per 50kg plus ketamine 100mg per mg medetomidine. Atipamezole reversal. Zoletil is very expensive - I had had problems with Zoletil years ago. Remember to use eye ointment or drops to prevent cornea drying out. Never use Zoletil on White Tigers. I suggest if you need to do few : do one first and see how he reacts then adjust the dose accordingly and get familiar with the reaction. You can easily misjudge their weight. Johan Wessels : Feedback on tiger relocation. Used your cocktail on a 100 + kg fat tame tiger. Went down in 3 min and went into deep sedation. Had to supply oxygen and adrenaline after atipamezole. Started to lift head after one hour and took another 5 hours to get up. My explanation for deep sedation: fatty liver? contributing to slow drug metabolism? Weight was probably even underestimated because 6 people battled to carry him. So definitely not an overdose. Would probably use half the dose under the same circumstances next time. Henry Labuschagne: If they are not up in 30min I give a second dose of Atipamezole. Role over to the other side and 10min later, prod judiciously. . I go up to 5mg atipamezole per 1mg medetomidine. I also like to give 1ml yohimbine/2 mg atipamezole im with the pure atipamezole. I inject antidote in 3 different sites deep im. Fatty liver could definitely have a negative effect. I would give him Heptonic and Hepavet to help detox the liver. PS : if you used Zoletil it would still be sleeping.
