Erik Verrynne, [25 Apr 2025 at 20:34:29]: I need some advice again please? The lioness with the Deslorin implant I asked about last year October in question. I sterilised her in November 2024 because she had a vaginal discharge, and the vasectomized males continued fighting. The pyometra was very mild. She was very fat, but I was quite confident that I removed the ovaries in total. Six weeks ago, the males started fighting again. Now they reported that she is in oestrus again and the males are fighting. How can I test if I have left a part of an ovary in her? Are there any other reasons that can cause the males to fight? Cystitis, extra-ovarial oestrogen sources? If so, what blood samples should I take and how soon must it be tested? Erik Verrynne, [26 Apr 2025 at 09:15:16]: Further to my question above. I have stumbled upon research indicating that spayed lionesses can show pheromone based in-season behaviour and attracting the attention of males. How common is it? Anyone experienced it? I am trying to avoid having to go in again. She is fat and post operative management, despite my instructions, were not great. Bart Gazendam, [26 Apr 2025 at 15:56:15]: I would probably test Anti-Müllerian hormone (AMH) combined with progesterone to see if there’s ovarian tissue left. If positive you might be able to get someone out to have a look laparoscopically? Erik Verrynne, [26 Apr 2025 at 16:58:15]: Thanks Bart. I watched her today. There is a bit of fighting between the two males, but not as much as I see with females on normal oestrus. I was shown a video where one male was trying to mount her. She is not showing the usual mating behaviour. She was not vocal, did not move and looked completely uninterested in the process. Not the usual oestrus driven behaviour… However, it is appropriate to see if there is ovarian tissue left. Which labs in SA can test for progesterone and AMH? Bart Gazendam, [27 Apr 2025 at 10:14:58]: I think Idexx does AMH, but might be good just to give OP Reproduction Dept. a call 😊 Erik Verrynne, [27 Apr 2025 at 10:56:45]: Thanks Bart. She was implanted with Supralorin 28 months ago. Would that not suppress the heat symptoms if it was a retained piece of ovary? And how would the presence of deslorelin affect the AMH and progesterone test? Morne de la Rey, [27 Apr 2025 at 19:25:07]: Erik - progesterone can be done by UP, Andre Ganswindt's lab. They don't do AMH. I have tried to find a lab in SA to do AMH some years back, but couldn't find one, so will be happy if you do find one and share with me too. Erik Verrynne, [27 Apr 2025 at 19:25:40]: Thanks Morne. Morne de la Rey, [27 Apr 2025 at 19:30:03]: I do think it will be interesting to see what the deslorelin does in respect of the other hormones. I also think that all these hormones need to be done repeatedly to build a graph as a single progesterone test is relatively meaningless AMH is correlated to the amount of follicular "activity" and hence can vary according to the size and number of follicles per animal. HH will be able to do a laparoscopy for you next time he is around in Botswana (as I guess the lioness is there) Erik Verrynne, [27 Apr 2025 at 19:32:44]: If I look at behaviour, then I am not convinced that the hormonal drivers are strong. It may very well be behavioural response or a local infection such as cystitis of vaginitis. But why the repeated cycle? Morne de la Rey, [27 Apr 2025 at 19:46:44]: I have no idea, as you should rather talk to Kurt de Kramer as she is a cat...... or some-one else that wants to dive into an answer. Cattle, ungulates and rhino don't do that. I also doubt your capabilities leaving ovarian tissue behind! I will do ultrasound scan first for all your infection possibilities, full blood profiles for infection and then laparoscopy. Personally, hormones will not be in my scope of tests
